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  1. #11
    Super Mod jfk's Avatar
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    Frankie

    Thank you for the update, that is what I would do eliminate the hydraulic system to ensure it's not the issue.
    When I freshen or do any major engine work which requires removal I C clamp the feet to a bench to test run it.
    BTW the other we try to keep to a minimum because we do have women and children frequent the site.

    Thanks
    Jim
    Last edited by jfk; 04-15-2017 at 08:13 PM.

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    Capt. Dan (04-15-2017)

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  4. #12
    Official Greeter Capt. Dan's Avatar
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    Hey Frankie,

    You'll find plenty of patience on this site for sure. It sure sounds like you've had your hands full with this tractor but you're making headway and learning in the process. There's Lots of help here so please ask with any questions. Best wishes and I'm looking forward to seeing your tractor.

    Capt Dan

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  6. #13
    Senior Member ING6018's Avatar
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    My first impression is that when you messed with the hoe, something got crossed up and you created a deadhead situation. The Parker HD 25AA2A14A tandem pump is the Achilles heel of these units. Parker rates them for 2500 PSI continuous, although, depending on year, your main travel control relief is set for 2450 or 2700 PSI.

    The smaller pump (1.4 GPM at 1000 RPM or 5 GPM) runs the power steering, backhoe and loader. It has a relief set for 1500 PSI.

    Is this the pump section that failed?

    Sometimes it is possible to hand turn a system. This does not mean that it is OK. Even if you had a serious restriction in the system, hand turning may still be possible because the pumps/motors etc. can be kinda leaky.

    Pulling the love-joy loose is a good idea. That will let us know if this is an engine or hydraulic issue. I suspect hydraulic.

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    bigman (04-15-2017)

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  9. #14
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    Hey all,
    Just getting back to thinking of pulling the pump. Something occurred to me. When I rebuilt the tandem pump HD25AA2A14A the second time I bought a nos H25AA2A off ebay for the front pump cover and parts. I can't remember If I set it up for clockwise or counter clock wise rotation. I am guessing if this is backwards it would be causing all my grief???? I will be back when I pull the pump and take pictures. for the hydraulic fluid I use 20w-50. Does anyone have a trick to remove the pump without causing another oil slick in my driveway? Also Does anyone know how to set up this pump for proper rotation?

    thanks

  10. #15
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    The pump that failed was the larger front pump section. The shaft seal blew out and internals were burnt color.I did however replace the smaller pump seals while I had it apart. And again I don't know if I set it up for proper rotation. I was thinking my original from pump cover had a hairline crack.

  11. #16
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    I also forgot to mention that the pump blew before I touched anything on the hydraulics or motor.

  12. #17
    Senior Member ING6018's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frankie View Post
    I also forgot to mention that the pump blew before I touched anything on the hydraulics or motor.
    Frankie:
    That really helps. I had gotten kinda lost in the sequence of events.
    You said you rebuilt the pump twice.
    What was the tractor doing when the pump blew the first time? (moving or sitting still?)
    What about the second time?

    Describe exactly what happened.

  13. #18
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    when the pump blew the first time I had just finished some work on the backhoe. I replaced lines, rebuilt a cylinder, dismantled the backhoe to replace seized pivot pins. I put it back together and needed to start the tractor to move the stabilizing arms to line up a couple broken welds where the backhoe attaches to the tractor. At that point the tractor was very difficult to start. When it did finally start it ran horrible. As I was trying to get it to smooth out , the pump let loose 2 gallons of burning hot hydraulic oil all over my driveway. So the tractor was sitting still when it happened. I took the pump apart and found the two shaft gears were pushed apart and bound up. the front seal was blown as well as other seals inside the large pump section. Also things looked blackened burnt color. I was able to polish the shafts back to shinny very easily. I bought and installed all new seals. Front seal was pushed up at least a quarter inch. While I was in there I also replaced all the secondary pump seals. small pump looked great inside. I am not sure at this point if I set up the seals for correct clockwise??? orientation. I reinstalled the pump and fought to get it started again. same horrible results and another two gallons of fluid everywhere. at that point I assumed the front pump cover had a hairline crack so I bought a nos 25AA single pump for parts. I used the new pump cover and seals to do the second rebuild. Again I am unsure of the orientation so when I pull the pump next I will tear into the pump to hopefully resolve that question. Wow this is like reliving my nightmares all over again. So after the third time with the pump the tractor no longer started and had a real drag to it so i was concerned something inside the engine was binding and that is why I pulled it the first time to rebuild and check clearances.



    i

  14. #19
    Senior Member ssmewing's Avatar
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    ING6018 is more the expert, but it sounds like a deadhead situation. I would look hard at the repairs you did before the pump blew. Like lines connected wrong.

    In the Tech Library at the very bottom of the forum page is a hydraulics section that has some great diagrams. Your setup will be at the end of the different configurations.

  15. #20
    Senior Member ING6018's Avatar
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    Frankie:

    We really want to help here, but (at least to me), you keep posting confusing or contradictory information.

    I agree with Steve that you have probably created a hydraulic lock (deadhead) situation. However, your explanations and responses to questions is inconsistent. For example, in post 16, you said:

    I also forgot to mention that the pump blew before I touched anything on the hydraulics or motor.

    In post 18 you said:

    when the pump blew the first time I had just finished some work on the backhoe. I replaced lines, rebuilt a cylinder, dismantled the backhoe to replace seized pivot pins. I put it back together and needed to start the tractor to move the stabilizing arms to line up a couple broken welds where the backhoe attaches to the tractor. At that point the tractor was very difficult to start. When it did finally start it ran horrible. As I was trying to get it to smooth out , the pump let loose 2 gallons of burning hot hydraulic oil all over my driveway. So the tractor was sitting still when it happened.

    I am really confused.

    We really need a specific and accurate blow-by-blow account of what happened and in what order. Details are really important here!

    1st failure:
    Do you mean that the tractor was operating normally until you worked on the hydraulics, and when you started the motor the pump blew?

    2nd failure:
    Are you saying that after rebuilding the pump, you started the engine again and it blew the pump again?

    3rd time?:
    In post 18 you mentioned a 3rd time.

    So after the third time with the pump the tractor no longer started and had a real drag to it so i was concerned something inside the engine was binding and that is why I pulled it the first time to rebuild and check clearances.

    Did you rebuild the pump 3 times (or just 2)?

    At this point, my guess is that you:
    1) worked on the hydraulics, created a deadhead in the hydraulic system, started the engine and blew the pump
    2) You rebuilt the pump, then restarted the engine and blew the pump again
    3) After rebuilding the pump for the second time, the engine would not start, so you refreshed the engine
    4) Now, the engine will not start (if so, this a good thing!!!). If that motor starts, you will probably blow the pump again!!!

    Now, I suspect there are additional variables at play.

    The small (D) section of the Parker HD pump normally runs the loader, power steering and backhoe. The larger (H) section is just used for travel. the fact that you keep blowing the larger H section is a real puzzle.


    Is your unit factory or and aftermarket add-on?
    Is the backhoe powered from the smaller (D) section or from the PTO valve located on the rear right fender?

    Dan

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