Tiller talk - Page 2
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 25

Thread: Tiller talk

  1. #11
    Senior Member Dan444's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    NY USA
    Posts
    253
    Thanks
    45
    Thanked 70 Times in 37 Posts
    I’m not familiar with the way pto/3 point works. I have an old three point and pto I’m going to get going on once the weather warms. I am kind of waiting til a tiller comes my way also.

    Is the normal lift lever that’s used for raising deck and caster used to raise and lower tiller or other pto attachments? Seems it must be.

    I do do have a spare mule gear actually that came with my project 444. (Which by the way starts runs and no longer leaks oil!!)

  2. Remove Advertisements
    CaseColtIngersoll.com
    Advertisements
     

  3. #12
    Senior Member BobAfton's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Grand Rapids, Michigan
    Posts
    177
    Thanks
    48
    Thanked 291 Times in 103 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan444 View Post
    Is the normal lift lever that’s used for raising deck and caster used to raise and lower tiller or other pto attachments? Seems it must be.
    Yes.
    And that brings up more discussion topics like "Selector Valve" and "F27 Sleeve Hitch Adaptor".
    Since you have the 3 point hitch and PTO, sounds like you're on your way.
    Bob

  4. #13
    Junior Member Ben L.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Green Bay, WI
    Posts
    19
    Thanks
    6
    Thanked 9 Times in 6 Posts
    Barnevelt implement has weight boxes. I bought one from them along with the front mule drive mount. The box comes with an angle iron bracket to mount on the rear of tractor but that won’t work with a tiller attached. Keep an eye out for used boxes. I picked one up for $50 box alone. Attached it to my mule drive mount and now have front and rear weight if necessary.

    For rear wheel weights I have the plastic you fill with sand. If doing it again, I would like to buy a set of JD H78062 wheel weights. Much heavier.

  5. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Ben L. For This Useful Post:

    Dan444†(01-12-2021),dundee222†(01-12-2021)

  6. Remove Advertisements
    CaseColtIngersoll.com
    Advertisements
     

  7. #14
    Senior Member Maine Willy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Scarborough, Maine
    Posts
    827
    Thanks
    1,085
    Thanked 639 Times in 311 Posts
    My first time rototilling was with a 4016 Vanguard, 40 inch tiller and turf tires (front and rear), so it can be done, but not easily. I did not have wheel weights, front weights or flow control. It was on level ground that had been plowed with a Brinly 12 inch plow. It was a 40 x 80 new garden with lots of room at the ends for maneuvering. It was over bamboo roots at one end (FYI - do not ever offer to till those if someone asks you to).

    I was able to do the tilling with much finessing of the TCV. There were a number of wheelies which were managed by not lifting the tiller all the way up. With a light front end, steering is difficult. The tiller pushed the tractor forward when running the tiller in forward rotation, so I just barely had the TCV in forward and the tiller would push it along. There are some members who run the tiller in reverse and then use the TCV to move the tractor forward; I tried that and it was less satisfactory as the turf tires would spin in the loose or hard dirt.

    FRONT WEIGHTS:
    IMHO, the first priority would be to get weight on the front end to minimize the pucker factor (wheelies) and help with steering. Seems to me someone could put up with fussing the levers for depth and travel if needed for a while.

    Today, for front weights, I have this bumper and hang 42lb suitcase weights off of it painted lobster red.

    https://casecoltingersoll.com/showth...mper+barneveld

    Safety tip: I used to transport the tractor and tiller on a tilt snowmobile trailer. The front weights were critical for loading/unloading as the front came up if the front weights were not on.
    If I forgot to put the front weights on the tiller kept it from going over..... that's how evenly balanced the unit is. The Vanguards are lighter than the Onans.

    FLOW CONTROL:
    Are a dream to till with as you can "set it and forget it" - just like cruise control. They work well when snow blowing too. That said, tilling can be done without it.
    In lieu of a flow control (until and if one can be located), tightening up the TCV linkage would be of help. At minimum replacing the link; even better to install the complete linkage replacement kit that is out there (Hemlock Case Guy I think - see ebay link)- it makes a world of difference but is a PITA to install.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Case-Ingers...0AAOSwYb9c4zLw

    AG TIRES
    Are helpful as they minimize spinning and help keep the ground evenly tilled as spinning can leave ruts which the have to be smoothed over. Seems to me chains on turfs would help, but I have not tried that.

    REAR WHEEL WEIGHTS:
    Are helpful for same reason as ags, but IMHO not absolutely necessary as the tiller will push the tractor along. They would be lower on my priority list.

    IDEAL SETUP:
    Front weights; Ag tires; Flow control; Rear wheel weights.

    Hope this long dissertation is of some help. Again, this is my experience and opinion - your mileage may vary.

    With Respect, Willy

  8. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Maine Willy For This Useful Post:

    Dan444†(01-12-2021),Gordy†(01-12-2021),kenpond†(01-13-2021),propane1†(01-13-2021),tss8690†(01-12-2021)

  9. #15
    Senior Member Gordy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Maple Lake, MN
    Posts
    2,526
    Thanks
    3,227
    Thanked 1,472 Times in 935 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan444 View Post
    Iím not familiar with the way pto/3 point works. I have an old three point and pto Iím going to get going on once the weather warms. I am kind of waiting til a tiller comes my way also.

    Is the normal lift lever thatís used for raising deck and caster used to raise and lower tiller or other pto attachments? Seems it must be.

    I do do have a spare mule gear actually that came with my project 444. (Which by the way starts runs and no longer leaks oil!!)

    Here is a link to a 3 Pt manual, it may not be specifically for yours, but the hydraulics are the same. Page 8 shows the installation procedure.

    https://manuals.casecoltingersoll.co...atermarked.pdf

    This OEM setup runs both midlift and 3 pt cylinders at the same time. This means the unloaded (lighter) cylinder moves to the end of its strock first, then the loaded (heavier) one starts to move. And slows the lift down. To avoid this and gain independent use of each cylinder, many have installed a selector valve. One of the Tee's is still used as in the manual, but a hose is run from the other port of the main valve to the selector valve (where ever you decide to mount it). Then a hose from the selector valve to each cylinder.

    Here are pictures of a couple selector valves that have been used. Just make sure the one you get is hydraulic rated, NOT air or water.





    Gordy

  10. #16
    Senior Member Seabee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Coldwater, Michigan
    Posts
    1,657
    Thanks
    298
    Thanked 524 Times in 308 Posts
    In about 1979 or 1980 I bought a 444 Demonstrator from the Case dealer with a 48" deck and a 41" tiller. I had no weight, no holding valve (didn't know they made such a thing until a lot later), no slow down valve. And I had turf tires for the back.

    Heck I was going all over the place tilling for our friends. The tiller would push the tractor, but being willing to pull the travel lever backward occasionally worked fairly well. Most of the soil was clay loam soil. After learning who the neighboring farmers were, I had the guy farming up against us plow my garden with his 5 16 plow, and I then would knock it down with my tiller.

    I never had any lift problems at the end when I got ready to turn around. I just lifted it up and did what I needed to do. In 1989 I moved to Michigan and didn't have any farmers living next to me. I had to break the sod for myself, again! Probably about mid 90's I bought a 448, still didn't have any weight, and got along well.

    I joined the site in 2013 as you can see, and found out I needed front end weight, and a slow down valve for sure. About 2015 I bought a junk 446 with Case plastic weights, one for each rear wheel. Put them on my 448 and they made a nice difference for snow plowing and tilling. In 2017 I happened upon a K41 tiller. Wasn't sure I even wanted it because I had been happy with my center drive Case tiller for 35+ years. So I put the K41 on my other 448 I had just renewed. Man was that sucker heavy! It wanted to twist my sleeve hitch counter clockwise to the left when it wasn't in the ground. Had to be a bit more careful when lifting it on the ends. Still no front weights.

    I should explain while I was a kid my dad was a bit tight with his money and bought a new Case 830 tractor with a 5 16 semi mounted plow behind it. Tires filled and a weight or 2 on each rear wheel. No further weight on the tractor, except the semi mounted plow on the hitch. The home farm was sandy, and as we moved to Cass County, Indiana the soils turned to heavy clay. The plows didn't pull nearly as easy. As my younger brother and I got into high school we played around with anything going on. On the one farm, the south end of a half mile long pull was a state highway running perpendicular to the direction we were going. If you just yanked on the hydraulic lever to lift the plow the front end would come off the ground momentarily. That was kind of cool! This farm also had very heavy soils, so if you lifted carefully on the lever you could keep the plow in the ground and carry the front end about as far as you wanted.

    That ability to keep the front end in the air led to us carrying the front almost to the highway several times. As we got close to the road there were a few times the people in the cars got a bit nervous.

    So the front lift issue was never an issue for my tiller. I will say with the extra weight of the K41 tiller, it wanted to dance a bit more. When I renewed the 448, one of my goals was to put beet juice in the front and rear tires. The second year I had the K41, the 448 had that extra weight (120# each rear, 20# each front). The front end can still get a bit light but does just fine. On the Snow Blower it makes the front more controllable on the ice.

    So my story is that for a bout 35+ years with the center drive, I never had any of that stuff and got along just fine. Now that I have the heavier tiller and I have the extra weight, I like that just fine! To each their own!!

    Bill
    Last edited by Seabee; 01-13-2021 at 01:04 AM.

  11. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to Seabee For This Useful Post:

    arcaseing†(01-13-2021),CobyDog$10†(01-13-2021),Dan444†(01-13-2021),Gordy†(01-13-2021),Harry†(01-13-2021),iko†(01-13-2021),Maine Willy†(01-13-2021),propane1†(01-13-2021)

  12. #17
    Senior Member sdunt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Central Illinois - Bloomington
    Posts
    1,694
    Thanks
    114
    Thanked 1,220 Times in 646 Posts
    The safety instructions in all CCI operator's manuals say:



    Quote Originally Posted by Maine Willy View Post
    Safety tip: I used to transport the tractor and tiller on a tilt snowmobile trailer. The front weights were critical for loading/unloading as the front came up if the front weights were not on.

    With Respect, Willy

  13. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to sdunt For This Useful Post:

    iko†(01-13-2021),tss8690†(01-13-2021)

  14. #18
    Senior Member CobyDog$10's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Location
    Beloit, Wisconsin
    Posts
    893
    Thanks
    2,341
    Thanked 677 Times in 344 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by sdunt View Post
    The safety instructions in all CCI operator's manuals say:

    And then strap that hood down!

  15. The Following User Says Thank You to CobyDog$10 For This Useful Post:

    Gordy†(01-13-2021)

  16. #19
    Senior Member sdunt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Central Illinois - Bloomington
    Posts
    1,694
    Thanks
    114
    Thanked 1,220 Times in 646 Posts
    for the non loader models you are correct. All of the 6xx, 6xxx and 7xxx loader's hoods open in the front and hinge at the back by the dash so backing them onto a trailer works best for them..

    But the 2,3,4xx series, yep strap the hood down..

  17. #20
    Senior Member Maine Willy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Scarborough, Maine
    Posts
    827
    Thanks
    1,085
    Thanked 639 Times in 311 Posts
    Even better safety tip. Thanks sdunt!

    With respect, Willy

    Quote Originally Posted by sdunt View Post
    The safety instructions in all CCI operator's manuals say:


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts